Oscar Volley: So many stars, too little shine in the Best Original Song race
Friday, January 28, 2022 at 4:00PM Welcome to our Oscar Volley series at The Film Experience. Each day, members of Team Experience will have a conversation about the Oscar categories. Today, Baby Clyde and Josh Bierman tackle the always controversial Best Original Song.
Ariana Grande, Van Morrison, Billie Eilish, Beyoncé
Baby Clyde: Has there ever been such a starry array of contenders with so little to offer? You’d think at least one from a list including Beyonce, U2, Carol King, Van Morrison, Jay Z, Billie Eilish and Brian Wilson would know how to write a good pop song. They’ve previously written some of the greatest of all time! Unfortunately there is an unwritten rule that even the finest tunesmiths turn in absolute garbage when an Academy Award is up for grabs. It’s got to the point where I actually feel bad for Diane Warren...
The woman who gave us stone cold classics "Nothing’s Gonna Stop Us Now", "Because You Loved Me", "How Do I Live" and "I Don’t Want To Miss A Thing" (Her first four losing Oscar nominations) has now resorted to annually composing a schlocky affirmational ballad, to tag on the end of a movie that nobody saw, in the desperate attempt to finally win the Oscar she’s obviously so craving. It’s embarrassing. Especially as the results are increasingly dismal.
Reba McEntire singing Diane Warren's latest Oscar hopeful "Somehow You Do"
I’m firmly of the belief that credit songs should be disallowed from the Original Song category. The song should have to be integral to the movie not just plonked on to the end for the sole purpose of enabling a famous musician to achieve their EGOT. Whilst I love her beyond all reason I firmly agree with Dolly’s "Travellin’ Thru'" loss. Are you #TeamThree6Mafia as well Josh???
Josh Bierman: Even as an "I Move On" stan, I am with you!! Songs that would like to qualify for this particular Oscar should be judged in exactly the way my mother always judges gratuitous sex or nudity in a movie: Does it further or serve the plot??? A song that is thrown over the closing credits does nothing for the story or for the audience. Submitting them for consideration is a blatant awards grab.
Diane Warren has openly said she wants it and while I respect that honesty, I'd respect it more if she wasn't being nominated for an endless parade of unmemorable credits songs. Props to Reba McEntire on the vocals, but Trish deserves better. All this being said--I won't be surprised if Diane scores yet another nomination. The music body clearly likes her. To borrow a phrase from Jared Leto at the 2015 Oscars when talking about Meryl, 'it's become California state law to nominate her yearly.'
I actually don't dislike the Billie Eilish and Beyoncé songs that made the finals. In the grand scheme of Oscar songs they may be forgettable, but in this year's finalist list they are stronger than most. Looking at the finalist list I'm wondering if the Academy is hoping to use the Best Song category to bring in viewers to a broadcast that consistently loses viewers yearly. Are we looking at a star studded category in a last ditch effort to save the telecast? I also noticed in that list of A Listers you began with you left out Ariana Grande. Do you find her to be one of the more deserving prospective nominees?
"Just Look Up" is that rare Original Song contender this year that is actually fully featured in its movie
Baby Clyde: HA! No shade to Ari. I just didn’t think she was on the same level as those other icons quite yet.
Josh Bierman: No shade taken! But at least her song serves a purpose in Don't Look Up, albeit a silly one.
Baby Clyde: My problem with all these songs is that they are so forgettable. Not a single one sounds like a hit. Compare these to the legendary 1984 line up which was wall to wall #1 smash hits.
Talking of hits. Lin Manuel Miranda and the Encanto crew really dropped the ball on which song to submit. The breakout track from the film is the Tik Tok sensation "We Don't Talk About Bruno". The biggest Disney hit since "Let It Go" made it to #4 on the Billboard chart is currently #1 in the UK (where I am). It's the first Disney song to ever reach that summit on our charts. A nominee with this success is an almost a guaranteed winner in a field with such indistinct competitors. Unfortunately, the powers that be decided to promote a sweet but forgettable Spanish language ballad called "Dos Orugitas" as their submission.
Why didn't Disney submit both songs? There's no evidence in Oscar history to suggest that songs from the same film cannibalize their nomination/win prospects
It’s baffling. With a film choc-a-block with memorable, integral musical numbers they’ve chosen the most forgettable least integral option possible. I mentioned earlier how this category is prime to deliver EGOT’s. Does Lin-Manuel not want his???
Josh Bierman: That's exactly my problem with these songs. They are completely forgettable and they offer none of what we're looking for in Best Original Song. They lack the show-stopping quality of "Shallow," or the emotional wallop of "Remember Me," or even just the straight up 'one of these things is not like the other' factor of "Hard Out Here For a Pimp!" They are capital B Boring. Star quality is all some of these songs have going for them.
I get the vibe that Lin-Manuel wants to EGOT as badly as Diane Warren wants to win at least one (1) Oscar, so I was similarly bewildered by the Encanto submission. I'm not sure If "We Don't Need to Talk About Bruno" would have been my first choice, but it certainly would have been my choice over a song from the credits of a movie musical!
In addition to Encanto this category is filled with movies that have stellar musical moments, but they are all made up of previously written material. I'm thinking of the "Both Sides Now" finale from CODA or the myriad musical numbers from Respect. Do we think shortlisting those movies for Best Song (for end credit numbers) is a way of honoring the musical moments that the Academy can't reward?
Baby Clyde: Questlove really missed a trick not composing an original song for the Summer of Soul credits didn’t he? They could have got Stevie Wonder and Gladys Knight to sing it. Somebody needs to hire me to run their campaign next year.
This category made sense 70 years ago when you had the Freed Unit banging out numerous MGM musicals annually and Judy Garland or Doris Day on hand to belt out a winning tune every couple of years. Those days are unfortunately long gone. Has it run it’s course? The whole thing at least needs a shake up.
Josh Bierman: Why stop at Questlove? Where was Lady Gaga's new techno bop "Haus Of Gucci" during the end credits?? I agree that the glory days of Best Original Song are clearly behind us. Maybe another change in the eligibility rules would shake things up. The Academy made a fuss a few years ago about limiting how many songs could be nominated from one movie. I would rather have three songs from one movie nominated than any song from the end credits of a movie. Do we need to start picketing outside the new Academy Museum?
Finalists that actually begin their movies rather than playing over the end credits
Baby Clyde: Anyway enough with the complaining. What do we predict is actually going to get nominated? I genuinely think that Billie Eilish is the only lock. The song’s a dirge but everyone knows it’s a Bond theme. Beyonce’s star power may get her over the line but if I remember correctly the name of the writers aren’t on the ballot just the song and the film. Despite the song being unremarkable I suspect Lin-Manuel Miranda gets in, then it’s just a matter of which Boomer Act has the most support in the music branch. Although I do have a suspicion that the Mael Brothers could sneak in for 'So May We Start'. The song is just about quirky enough to stand out from the crowd.
Are you down with Billie, Beyonce and Lin?
Josh Bierman: I agree that Billie is the only solid lock here and I think it's hers to lose. It's the strongest song of the bunch. I think Miranda is a safe bet too. I'm pretty on the fence about Beyoncé. I think it's one of the stronger songs on the finalist list, but I can see the Academy not including her and choosing more traditional options or folks they've nominated in the past. I think our reigning champ H.E.R will pop up again for "Automatic Woman", she delivers another earworm and I think folks in the music branch will remember her spirited performance in last year's pre-show fondly. Though that may mean nothing if what you said before is true regarding how a song is billed on the ballot. The lack of an artist's name next to the song on the ballot is news to me and you really gotta wonder how Diane Warren keeps popping up if that's the case. However, I wasn't kidding before when I said I think Diane Warren will pull off another nomination. She's been nominated time and again for so many duds, why should this year be any different?
I think the last slot will go to Jennifer Hudson and Carole King who would be receiving her very first Oscar nomination. Again, the song is not good, but it's elevated by Hudson's vocals. We've also recently seen a trend of Best Actress contenders popping up as Best Song nominees. Makes me wonder if Hudson's name is announced in Best Song on February 8th, will that foreshadow an acting nomination later that morning?
What do you see rounding out the category? Also, do you think there are any songs on the shortlist that deserve a nomination but will be snubbed or is that laughable in this group?
Baby Clyde : Apologies for the delay in replying. I was consulting with some Oscar nerd friends as to whether names were printed on ballots or not. No one was 100% sure but the general consensus is that only Acting, Directing and maybe Writing awards name the potential nominees. If anyone out there knows different, please let us know we’re completely wrong.
Anyway, back to the matter at hand. I’m in completely agreement about JHud. Her Best Actress prospects have certainly risen in recent weeks and surely the trend of an actress nominee also being nommed in Best Song has a high chance of continuing (I’ll meet you back here in a couple of days to discuss her acting chances).
I’m not so sure about H.E.R. Last year’s win was one of the more baffling in recent memory. I think I had her 5th in my predictions and couldn’t as much as hum any portion of the winning composition. I sat here listening to this year’s entry as we speak and again, it doesn’t seem to have a tune (Although it does seem to have at least 3 time signatures!).
will Idina Menzel become a regular performer at the Oscars?
To answer your question, I do not think there are any songs on the shortlist that deserve a nomination but will be snubbed, because I’m not convinced any of the songs on the list deserve to nominated. Having said that I’m quite partial to the Idina Menzel number from that unnecessary Cinderella movie that I will never watch. Sometimes a great vocal can elevate a record (Do people still says "record"?) and this one is at least a pacy number, unlike most of the others.
Oh, and Gaga’s credit song should have been Italo Disco. Imagine the video!
Josh Bierman: "Italo Disco," now wasn't that the name of the song Diane Warren was nominated for last year for the Sophia Loren movie? It seems the only way for us to know what the ballot looks like is by writing our own song, being nominated, and then asked to join the music branch of the Academy. I'll start right after I hit send on this.
'Beach Boys lite'
I wouldn't call it a snub if it's not nominated, but I found "Right Where I Belong" from Brian Wilson: Long Promised Road to be one of the better songs on the shortlist. It could be because it has that Beach Boys sound (though more Beach Boys Lite), but maybe it'll have a shot thanks to the older members of the music branch.
I completely agree about a good vocal elevating a ho hum track. I'd say that's the case with more than half these songs. Unsurprisingly, Idina's vocals are pretty stellar. Perhaps the wickedly talented Adele Dazeem will find herself singing on the telecast for the third time in less than ten years, but I'm doubtful. Maybe she's free for the In Memoriam. It's going to be a long one this year, so maybe she'll be joined by the other also rans in this category for a morose medley.
Baby Clyde: Do you think the Board of Governors have been having a sneaky word with the music branch about making sure the line-up is as starry as possible? I’m sure ABC would love to promote appearances by Beyonce, Billie, Jay Z, JHud and Ariana. It’s not as if the films themselves will be bringing in the viewers. This is one of the reasons I still approve of the category. The musical performances definitely have the ability to make the show more interesting and I’m sure they’ll be going all out this year to make some memorable moments.
I’m sorry but I’m going to have a whinge again. We both agree that Billie Eilish is the current favourite mostly I think because it’s a Bond Theme and in recent years they've become the go to winners in this category (As Diane Warren will undoubtedly remember). The middling 'Skyfall' was, unaccountably, the first ever Bond track to win, followed by the execrable caterwauling that was 'The Writing’s On The Wall'. Not "Goldfinger", or "Diamonds are Forever", or "Live and Let Die", or "Nobody Does It Better" or "A View to A Kill" just these poor imitations that we’re now lumbered with. "No Time To Die" is passable but it’s no "Licence to Kill".
Maybe Diane needs to write a Bond Theme?
Josh Bierman: Wow, am I in the minority for loving "Skyfall?" I thought we all loved that one.
Baby Clyde: "Skyfall" is fine. Really glad Adele has an Oscar but it doesn’t stimulate and tease me like some previous Bond songs.
Josh Bierman: I'm surprised Diane Warren hasn't written a Bond song yet. Or at least I'm surprised she hasn't gotten back to writing for major movies and not the kind of movie where the only chance of a nomination is her song.
Looking at this list, it's clear the Academy is banking on musical performances to bring in a larger audience. Especially as they hope to return to a more normal format than last year. I also think The Oscars sometimes have a restorative power for mediocre songs. Songs that lack oomph in a movie or listening after the fact are sometimes enhanced by the production value the Oscars offer. I remember finding the nominated song from Harriet to be unmemorable, but Cynthia Erivo gave it so much life on the telecast. As middle of the road as these songs might be, I don't think that means we're in for a boring night of performances. We'll see if COVID has other plans.
Here’s what I am ultimately predicting. I feel a little unsure since our discussion, but I'm sticking to my guns:
- "No Time To Die" (No Time to Die)
- "Automatic Woman" (Bruised)
- "Somehow You Do" (Four Good Days)
- "Here I Am (Singing My Way Home)" (Respect)
- "Dos Oruguitas" (Encanto)
Alternate: "Be Alive" (King Richard)
What are you nailing down?
Baby Clyde: Completely agree with you about Cynthia Erivo that was the exact example I was thinking of. The production number really made the song come alive. Let’s hope Reba can do the same.
So what are my final predictions? The honest truth is I have no idea past the three we agree on. I’m going to drop Diane because I think even the music branch must be tired of her shenanigans. They need to nominate her again when she’s stopped coasting and actually has a chance to win again, and I’m not convinced they could pick H.E.R. out of a line-up so totally winging it and going with…..
- "No Time To Die" (No Time to Die)
- "Here I Am (Singing My Way Home)" (Respect)
- "Dos Oruguitas" (Encanto)
- "Be Alive" (King Richard)
- “So May We Start” (Annette)
I’m not remotely confident in these picks. Fully expecting them to be wrong but as the 1956 winner taught us...
Que sera, sera
Whatever will be, will be
The future's not ours to see
Que sera, sera
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Reader Comments (15)
This cracks me up for some reason.
I see what you did there.
Anyway, the nominees are from CODA, Encanto, King Richard, Respect and No Time to Die. (I wanted to type Annette, but I can't decide what to replace.)
Warren is shameless even pretending these are original songs written for specific motion pictures. She has a piano bench full of these terrible, generic platitudes that she just pulls out any time a producer comes calling.
THIS^^^^
Rumour has it that's exactly what Stevie Wonder did with 'I Just Called To Say I Love You'.
^^^^I believe that. It's the worst song he ever released.
Diane Warren... may she never win that Oscar along with that no-talent asshole David Foster.
Go with Sparks! They have written many incredible songs that many in the world aren't aware of. If anyone here doesn't thing "Number One Song in Heaven" is one of the greatest songs ever... someone is going to get hurt.
I agree that this category is looking worse than ever before…
I loved Skyfall, but that Sam Smith number was a big yikes.
Fun fact: Lana Del Rey wrote the song ‘24’ (featured on her Honeymoon album) for Spectre, the 24th film in the Bond franchise.
It’s light years above Sam Smith’s track, but I presume the powers that be chose Sam Smith as he was the “bigger” artist at the time. 🥱
Too bad.
Some underrating of the recent Bond songs here! Skyfall "middling"? I like the Sam Smith song! And I think the Billie Eilish song works very well in No Time to Die. Bond at that point believes he's been betrayed. And the way the song comes in, accompanied by the Dr. No-like dots on the screen: beautiful!
Re: Encanto, let's be fair to Disney... nobody had any way of knowing We Don't Talk About Bruno would be that big. In fact, the film hadn't even been released by the submission deadline, and since Lin-Manuel Miranda has another project with songs with vying for nominations and only two songs that he wrote from any film could be submitted (if I'm understanding the new guidelines correctly), you can't fault Disney with going with the choice that made the most sense at the time.
When it comes to Disney songs, AMPAS has a history of primarily awarding their ballads. "Beauty and the Beast", "A Whole New World", "Can You Feel the Love Tonight", "You'll Be In My Heart"... even "Let It Go" is kind of a power ballad (yes, "Under the Sea" also won, but that song was an exception).
Looking at that, it probably made sense to go with the only ballad in the soundtrack, especially one that plays during the film's emotional climax (which was made into a montage and sung by an off-screen presence for some reason).
Diane Warren has written a song for a Bond film! Celine Dion’s megahit If You Asked Me To originally ran over the end credits of Licence To Kill, and was performed by Patti LaBelle. Sadly the Academy ignored it entirely.
Completely disagree with the comments about "Dos Oruguitas". It's not simply a song over the credits - it's part of the most emotional/moving/gut wrenching part of the film. "We don't talk about Bruno" has been a surprise hit - but by the time submissions were due no one would have guessed this. If you look back at the musical reviews (before the recent hit) Dos Oruguitas was always listed as the top song for the film. It's easy to reduce it to a bad choice now that you have a massive hit, but musically, and the message it brings to the film + being a non-english language song - I 100% think they made the right choice.
Really hoping So May We Start makes the final 5.
This was the most fun thing I've read in a long time here. So much truth telling really. Anyway, I hope that Lin-Manuel gets nominated and that he wins as a sort of overall Oscar for the incredible year he's had. It's really the only way to honor him and if Disney drops the ball on that, they deserve to lose!
baby clyde & josh -- this was a really fun read.
everyone -- I disagree with the notion that no one involved could have known. WE DON'T TALK ABOUT BRUNO is amazing *in* the film. Why would that song being popular be a surprise to anyone? Streaming culture is so weird. people are perpetually acting like things dont exist until they're streaming but Disney executives and everyone involved with Encanto and a months worth of audiences had seen this before it hit streaming.
I just dont understand why they didn't submit both. I agree that ballads tend to win the Oscar but nothing in Oscar history suggests that submitting multiple songs cannibalizes or splits the votes for Disney musicals. Still if i had a choice, i would have submitted "surface pressure" and "bruno" which are the two best numbers in the movie.
Joey -- its true that Dos Orugitas is within the film in an important way, but it *is* also the closing credits song.
"its true that Dos Orugitas is within the film in an important way, but it *is* also the closing credits song."
That's true of every single Disney song that has won the Oscar for Best Original Song... go back and watch The Little Mermaid, you'll see they re-play Under the Sea over the closing credits, and the rest all have pop versions over the closing credits (the Celine and Peabo version of Beauty and the Beast, the Peabo and Regina Belle version of A Whole New World, the Elton John version of Can You Feel the Love Tonight, the Alessia Cara version of Let it Go), which to me says that Disney, in a way, grooms these songs to become the most memorable song on their soundtrack (given that hearing them over the closing credits makes you remember that you heard them within the film) and for them to become their big Oscar song, even if other songs are also nominated. For Encanto, they went with Dos Orugitas... We Don't Talk About Bruno is the closest thing the film has to a "villain song" (given that they sing about a character who, at that point in the narrative, you may be forgiven if you believe he's going to be a villain), and those have never been nominated (I don't think they've ever even been considered).
As for why Encanto didn't submit two songs, I think it's because if they did, then Vivo wouldn't be able to submit any songs, as both soundtracks are by Lin-Manuel Miranda and, as far as I understand the eligibility rules, he could only submit two songs from any film he worked on that year, so I definitely get the strategy of going for one from Vivo and one from Encanto (even if the Vivo song ultimately missed the shortlist).
"It’s baffling. With a film choc-a-block with memorable, integral musical numbers they’ve chosen the most forgettable least integral option possible"
"That's exactly my problem with these songs. They are completely forgettable and they offer none of what we're looking for in Best Original Song. They lack the show-stopping quality of "Shallow," or the emotional wallop of "Remember Me," or even just the straight up 'one of these things is not like the other' factor of "Hard Out Here For a Pimp!" They are capital B Boring. Star quality is all some of these songs have going for them."
Did you watch the same movie? I've now seen this three times in three groups and *every* time "Dos Orugitas" and the backstory is what makes people cry. How is it missing the emotional wallop? Because it's not in English? How is it not integral? It's literally the song that plays that resolves everything in the movie - it's absolutely essential to understanding the suffering that she had gone through and leads to the resolution.
I think it should be very obvious why this song was chosen, not based on what would be the most popular hit - but what the most impactful song in the movie was. It should also be stated that for a movie that so importantly increases the steps disney is taking to add diversity to the lineup - it's fantastic that they chose a Spanish language song to submit. :
"Bruno" got stuck in my head after watching the movie - and it's a catchy catchy song, but it feels very light in comparison. I would say that "Surface Pressure" would have been a stronger argument if you were against Dos Orugitas