Interview: Sean Baker and Simon Rex on 'Red Rocket'
Monday, January 31, 2022 at 9:30PM by Nathaniel R
What film character will you remember best from the past year? One of our contenders for that crown is, for better and worse, Mikey Saber, the motor-mouthed adult film actor in Red Rocket. Better, because he's wonderfully written by Sean Baker and brilliantly played by Simon Rex. Worse because he's a walking disaster and narcissistic predator. Though the indie grossed a solid $1 million in limited release, it would surely have been a bigger success if its raucous mix of sex/cringe/character comedy could have played to more crowded theaters in non-pandemic times. Still, a Cannes competition premiere, 3 Gotham Award nominations, and a Los Angeles Film Critics Association win for Best Actor makes Red Rocket's brief run a major success. The film and Simon Rex's devilishly funny star turn are both bound to pick up more admirers soon on home viewing.
We had the privilege of sitting down briefly with writer/director Sean Baker and star Simon Rex prior to the release to talk about the film. [This interview has been edited for length and clarity...]
One thing that surprised me a bit after seeing the film is hearing that you had Simon audition for the role. It was such a star-vehicle that it felt like it was written for him!
SEAN BAKER: In a way it was. Meaning, five years ago when this idea came up, I was speaking to one of my producers, and I said, 'if we ever make this film... this guy!' and I forwarded one of Simon's vines or Instagram. But then we went off and developed another film.
When we finally got back to doing this, we didn't reach out to him until the last minute. We wanted to make sure this was actually a go. We were shooting during COVID. We were going to Texas. And so we were in it by the time we called him.
So Simon, did you get a full script at the time or?
SIMON REX: Basically, he sent me one small paragraph from the opening scene when I show up at Lexi's door and I'm trying to get in to stay in her house. I'm just sweet talking her. So it was just one little piece of that. And, so just on this phone right here [picks up his cel phone] I put it on my kitchen counter and I did a cold read and sent it in. Sean liked the energy and said, 'I need you here in three days. If I fly you here we have to quarantine for a week, so we got you a rental car down the street. Get here ASAP!'
That's insane. And you were free and ready to jump in?
Yeah. Obviously during the pandemic, there wasn't any stuff in production already and, and work had, you know, not been abundant over the last few years. In July of 2020 there was nothing going on. So yeah.
Good timing! One thing about your character Mikey is that he is not somebody who, uh, thinks things through..
[Laughter]
But, to be an actor and carry this, you have to have thought him through...
I mean, you just gotta plow through and commit. Mikey doesn't think about what he's saying or doing, so it's just diarrhea mouth. knew that the energy and pacing and reading had to be really really fast. It just all comes dumping out. That's easy for me to tap into that kind of rhythm. My brain kind of already works that way. And, yeah, I'm probably guilty of saying things before I think through them as well.
That was the energy. There was so much dialogue -- I mean, you saw the movie. It was just a lot. It couldn't be done any other way.
You always sound spontaneous in the film, with the speed, and it plays like you're improvising but maybe not?
SEAN BAKER: I always encourage improv. And a lot of my favorite lines in the film came from the improv of my great actors, but yeah, the rants were scripted. They had to be for obvious reasons -- exposition, character building, fleshing out. And also Mikey, and the men who I have met who are like him, they win their battles by exhausting you with their motor mouths. And Simon got that. I wanted him to be able to just spew this stuff out, um, to the point where you're not even really, truly, clocking everything that's being said until later.
When I was meeting a lot of these men -- it actually comes from my research on Starlet-- I would be entertained in the moment. I would actually be laughing.
Right, right.
SEAN BAKER: And then driving home at the end of the night, I would be like, 'Why was I laughing? That's terrible stuff that I just heard... That feeling of how torn I was, just even being in their presence. That's what I wanted to apply to the character and the film and have the audience feel that way, too.
SIMON REX: [To Sean] I'm still finding like easter eggs. I don't know if you did this on purpose, but a couple of times in the movie this train comes plowing through, just blaring. And I thought 'That's Mikey. He's that train from hell.'
Since Sean often works with first time actors, it's an easy misconception that people are just playing themselves. Did you worry about that given your past and the infamous masturbation video?
SIMON REX: No, I wasn't worried about it. At this point that's such old news and I've just moved on so much. I was just excited to work with Sean. It's really is just sort of a subtext, you know? Obviously that's an easy connection to make. I was appreciative that Sean thought of me and I knew that this required, you know, a lot of being vulnerable and open. I'm at a point where, 've been through it all. And I was willing to just dive into the deep, and have no ego.
Projects like Red Rocket, Starlet, Tangerine... Your movies are so good but high-wire! Honestly they're the type that could have gone wrong at any time! Are you nervous while making these things or do you just trust they'll work out?
SEAN BAKER: I've been... because of my budgets, I have limitations thrown at me all day, every day, and I have to deal with those. I hate it in the moment. I'm complaining in the moment. Why am I not making a Marvel film? [Laughs] But then I realize those limitations are what leads to happy accidents and serendipity. I've gotten so much gold from just allowing things to happen.
And so, I accept it. But it's been a battle my whole career where it's like complaining in the moment, but very, very, very full of gratitude afterwards.
How do you approach non-actors about these projects? I guess it's easier now that it sounds. You have a filmmography you can show people...
SEAN BAKER: We're living in a weird time because you don't have physical media anymore. Right up until The Florida Project, I was basically able to give people my DVDs. I would have them in my backpack. Now you take out your phone and go, 'uh... look up my name on IMDB.' It's a littler bit harder now! But, you know, I take pride in the street casting thing. I've been so incredibly lucky with my casts over the years, I've found people who want to collaborate, who've had that enthusiasm.
I mean, look at Brittney Rodriguez who plays June. She was 100% open to the idea. She said, 'oh, I'm an artist myself. And this sounds good. Let's exchange information.' And so when you find that person, and then you realize that they also have an incredible amount of talent. It's such a wonderful Feeling.
Simon, what was it like for you as the lead, to flip back and forth between professionals (like Bree Elrod who has a theater career) and first time actors?
with his leading ladies, Bree Elrod and Suzanna Son
SIMON REX: Bree, I just knew right away that she was a black belt in her craft and that I had to raise to her level. It's just like, anything else, like when you play basketball with guys who suck, you're gonna play shitty. If you're with good players, your game steps up. And then Suzy [Suzanna Son] who's a first time actor -- she's an entertainer naturally and had already come to LA because she had something -- they made my job a lot easier. I had to raise my skills to make this character believable and vulnerable.
The first time actors were the best. The world Sean put me in just felt so real compared to, you know, shooting a movie in Burbank, with a bunch of extras who all want to be famous.
I was speaking to Brittney and she told me that her favorite scene to shoot was the comic scene where you're naked and almost everyone is in the room, kicking you out. What was your favourite scene?
SIMON REX: That was -- there was definitely a lot of physical stuff going on. That was a tricky scene. It was hard to tell at the time if we were pulling it off. [To Sean] I remember we shot the heck out of that one.
SEAN BAKER: Yeah.
SIMON REX: it was a lot of angles. We made it work. My favorite scene to shoot? I really liked all the stuff with Lonnie in the car where I'm just ranting -- that's full Mikey in his element, just basically having an audience. He just wants to talk to someone, you know? Those scenes were really fun and obviously like the strip club was a fun world to play in. Some of the locations were just so cool. But it was all an amazing experience -- the whole thing.
The 'Red Rocket' team at Cannes
You've spent a lot more time promoting and travelling with the movie than you spent shooting it. How many times have you seen it now?
SIMON: All the way through maybe six or seven times. A lot of times we go to dinner and come back at the end. But I like to hear the audience. It's cool to see how different places and cities around the world react and what jokes land. Obviously, if you're in a country like -- we were in Hungary. Mikey speaks so fast. They're not going to get all the jokes because they're reading it and it's so fast. But in America, obviously they're getting it all quicker. It's just interesting.
I know you've never really stopped working but this is a new level for you as an actor. You're getting a lot of attention. What do you hope to do next?
SIMON REX: I just want to continue to work with people like Sean. Not too many directors in America are doing what Sean's doing, so I'm very aware of how special and unique this one was. We didn't have a lot of the amenities and the comforts in the trailer and this and all that. It was just rogue and it was go go shooting shooting shooting. It was crazy but the chaos worked. I want to do more movies like this. I don't know how realistic that it.
I also want to do more dramatic stuff as I feel I was never was given that opportunity. And I always want to do comedy. I kind of just want to do it all and just work with good filmmakers and continue to surprise people. I don't think anyone expected this and I'm happy with the way it came out. I'm looking forward to what's next. I don't know what that looks like, but it's gonna be fun.
Red Rocket is currently available to buy digitally on various service. It hits DVD and Blu-ray on March 15th, 2022.
Best Actor, Sean Baker, Simon Rex, Starlet, Tangerine, Texas, comedy, interview
Reader Comments (7)
I love Sean Baker’s films so much - I’d been anticipating Red Rocket since I heard about it. I really wish the release had been better, so maybe Simon would’ve had a better shot at awards contention. Given the large musical slate this year, he couldn’t even snag a Globe comedy nom which was kinda upsetting.
Although I haven’t seen it yet (very much looking forward to finally doing so), just based on what I’ve heard about his performance, it would be so fun to see him surprise on Oscar nom morning. Although he’s a dark horse, it wouldn’t be totally out of the question.
Loved the film the script and Rex but for me the unsung hero is Bree Elrod,I would never have thought she was professional,she was so open and natural,I'd have her on my ballot and Rex to.
I really liked the movie and Simon Rex gives the most zany balls-to-the-wall performance I have seen in a long time. I don't know how much he drew from his singing career because the personas seem very similar. But absolute kudos to him. And his performance works in part because Bree Elrod balances him out well. Those two performances are textbook commitment to the role.
I am still iffy on the use of non-professional actors in Baker's films. I get that they add authenticity. And it helps if they are artists, like Rodriguez, who is so great in RR (she's a MFing star IMHO). I get that professional actors might not provide the necessary authenticity. I just think the film only works when there's the right balance. I think Baker found the balance here, mostly found the balance in Tangerine and Starlet, and didn't get the right balance at all in Florida Project.
Charlie G - The Florida Project broke my heart both times I watched it - I love that movie. Who didn’t work for you? I could make a guess, but I’m curious.
Charlie G -- i have the same question as Philip since that's my favourite of his movies (though i also LOOOOOOVE Tangerine)
@Philip H and Nathaniel - It's all subjective. I 100% support your love of FP. I had a few issues with it.
I didn't need 2+ hours of cute kid preciousness in the forefront of destitution and corporate-greed-is-bad to get the message. I got the message in like 10 minutes. But by spending so much time on the kid, I think it dulled the message and made the adult characters flat. The mom was supposed to be troubled, but wanted to get what her kid wants. But did we get the full story? I don't think so. Along those lines, I think it's an easy out when you focus the movie around a single mom and her super cute precious little kid. What if the dynamics were different? Did the movie capture that? I'm not so sure. Maybe it shouldn't have ... but then I don't think we should be talking about how realistic and humanist it is.
Also, I want to use an analogy for the Willem Dafoe character. And it isn't perfect by any means, so just go with me for a second. But what if the Willem Dafoe character was played by a black man? Do you think we would be teetering on the outskirts of this territory:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magical_Negro
Don't get me wrong. That trope is waaaaaay worse than anything going in this movie. But I see similarities. A hardworking blue collar man just trying to do his job and also selflessly making sure that the troubled residents stay out of trouble. If we're trying to make a humanist and realistic movie, I think the character does not adequately represent the reality or complexities of that situation.
I do love Sean Baker though. He's doing stuff other people are not doing. I loved Tangerine and Red Rocket. I just think FP is his worst work.
I've admired all of Sean Baker's films, but my favorite by far is Starlet (2012) a true masterpiece, and if you've seen this year's Swedish/Dutch Pleasure, which covers a lot of the same ground, you can compare and see that Starlet is superior in every way.