Q&A: Buffyverse Actors, The Isabelles, Actresses We Don't "Get"
Thursday, May 24, 2018 at 3:16PM by Nathaniel R
This is always so much fun. Why do I go so long inbetween "episodes"? You asked a bunch of questions so here are a bunch more answers. Continue the conversation with your own answers to these questions why don't you? We thrive on community here not just blabbering at you.
So let's get right to the Reader Qs, shall we?
RYAN T: Just got back from vacation where I visited Italy for the first time. Alas no epic romance Call Me By Your Name style... but it did make me wonder: what are some of your favorite Italian films?
NATHANIEL: I have never been to Italy. AND I have never had an epic vacation romance. I FEEL CHEATED! I could definitely use some boning up on Italian cinema and am happy to take suggestions from all of you.
I'm afraid my answers in this regard are very "basic cinephile" but here are the 8½ I'd probably list as my favorites...
Teorema
In no particular order:
- Teorema (1968)
- Seven Beauties (1975)
- Rocco and His Brothers (1960)
- La Dolce Vita (1960
- I Am Love (2009/2010)
- The Bicycle Thief (1948)
- I Vitelloni (1953)
- Yesterday Today and Tomorrow (1963)
- Cinema Paradiso (1990) I remember crying out my eyes at the latter but I get the sense that people think that one is schmaltz and I only saw it that one time when it came out and I was much younger. So consider this a half vote.
I'll admit that I'm not sure I "get" L'Aventura (1960) or Fellini's Satyricon (1969). I probably don't love La Strada (1954) as much as I should. Naughty naughty. And though I totally recognize / bow down to its genius I prefer Bob Fosse's All That Jazz to Fellini's 8½ while recognizing that the former would not exist without the latter.
Emma Caulfield as AnyaBUFFY BUFF: What do you think about Sarah Michelle Gellar’s career in film and of her in general as an actress? In that note, who do you think (if anyone) should have had a better film/tv career of the Buffyverse actors?
What an unexpected question. I have to admit I haven't seen Gellar much onscreen apart from Buffy (though she was fun in Cruel Intentions and I did watch her TV show Ringer) so my association with her is almost strictly Buffy, the role she was born to play. I think most of the Buffy actors got the kind of steady careers they deserved thereafter with intermittent highs here and there as fate and talent allowed. But for one: Why did Emma Caulfield Ford not explode into a major star? Anya was such a singular creation and Emma could bring belly laughs and turn poignant on a dime. The lack of a huge or even medium-sized high profile career afterwards is a total tragedy. My runner up would be Tom Lenk who was hilarious as Andrew but at least we have Lenk Lewks.
DAVID: Which iconic Isabelle do you prefer: Huppert or Adjani?
Isabelle Adjani in Camille Claudel
A question designed to turn the masses against me! Because my answer is Adjani. Yes, Huppert is more consistently and far more currently a genius but Adjani was one of my very first international loves so she is dear to me. She and Deneuve both defined FRANCE in a mystical way for me before I knew anything about anything including probably where France was. (No, just kidding, I knew that. My parents house had one of those spinny globes in the living room -- do those still exist? -- and I used to love spinning it as a child and sticking my finger on it to stop it and seeing where I had "travelled" to and then discovering what that country was about. Nerdy!)
Anyway... When Adjani is "on," there's no one like her. But she did peak early unlike Huppert which is why it's understandable that Huppert's legend only grows while Adjani is hardly spoken of. But this is a Sophie's Choice because they're both magnifique.
ANA: What's your favorite and least favorite Woody Allen character performance in a Woody Allen movie.
I'm assuming you mean characters played by Woody himself? Or do you just mean his proxy characters? My least favorite Woody character is easily the Kenneth Branagh role in Celebrity (1998). That movie was so long ago and its only redeeming elements as I can recall were Charlize Theron and Leonardo DiCaprio's in small parts, so I admit I don't remember if I just hated Branagh's performance or the character, too. My favorite Woody character that Woody himself played is Mickey from Hannah and Her Sisters (1986). Everything about that film is lovely... especially Dianne Wiest's Oscar winning performance.
AMANDA: Who is your least favourite major actress of the last 15 years, and why?
This question is mean. I love everyone. Especially actresses! Most of the really big female stars at the moment are extremely talented -- even the more divisive ones like Lawrence and Hathaway -- so essentially we all win. Most of my rare "beefs" are prior to the last 15 years, thankfully. So other than Chloe Moretz who has driven me crazy from the very start (and not in the good way) I can only think of one I don't respond to at all: Emilia Clarke. I've found her mediocre (at best) in literally everything I've seen her in. And yet she keeps getting leading roles! But being part of a massive cultural hit generally insures that your fame level can grow far past the reaches of your perceived talent.
A caveat: I've been wrong before. I thought Kristen Stewart was a similarly empty actress until Twilight was over and she spread her indie art film wings. She proved me wrong so there's still hope for Moretz and Clarke. And I hope they do prove me wrong because there are few things as sweet and fulfilling as being surprised by the depth and magnificnce of a great screen performance. Being humbled by artistry in this particular way is a gift. It reminds you to remain open-minded while engaging with art.
I'M TOTALLY CURIOUS TO HEAR WHICH ACTOR OR ACTRESS YOU DON'T "GET" IN THE COMMENTS. And what do you make of the Buffyverse actors outside of Buffy?
Reader Comments (65)
I don't get Elizabeth Moss yet; though I also didn't watch much "Mad Men". Her performance in "Top of the lake" drove me up the wall.
Although I also find that's true with me for a lot of prestige TV actors - if I don't know their most famous role, I'm often confused about their presence/performances elsewhere. Not sure if I'm just missing a key text or missing the residual goodwill that helps others give them the benefit of the doubt.
Last year I didn't get Timothee Chalamet (in any of his 3 movies) or Tiffany Haddish.
Some favorite Italian movies: Nights of Cabiria, Umberto D, Il Posto, Seven Beauties, Gamorrah, Big Deal on Madonna Street, The Organizer, China Is Near, The Children Are Watching Us, Stolen Children; and if they count Battle of Algiers, Once Upon a Time in the West and The Good, the Bad and the Ugly
And The Leopard, of course!
Thank you for answering the question. It was meant in light-heartedness,I promise XD
I guess the reason I asked was because I had major reservations about Melanie Griffith *for years* and I was wondering if there were any modern actresses who you just don't 'get'. And I want to re-iterate, I'm not down for sh****ng on hard working actresses, but there are so many talented actresses who have yet to be discovered, that when a mediocre talent gets headlining gigs, it does irk me a good bit.
And yes, I'm aware that caring too much about these things can be trivial at best and downright psychotic at worst. The internet is full of poisonous people at online forums and one of the best things about this blog is how (mostly) positive it is, even when the conversations can be turn negative,
I totally understand where you're coming from on Emilia Clarke, yet I think she's a lot like the subject of a previous question - Sarah Michelle Gellar. Clarke is outstanding as Daenerys because it's the part she was born to play. I don't know that she'll ever be as good in anything else.
And the actress I don't get - Anna Kendrick. Maybe it's because she's clearly multi-talented but isn't stretching herself at all. She needs a Clouds of Sils Maria moment.
Calling Jennifer Lawrence "extremely talented" is mighty generous of you, Nathaniel. She is one actor who I do not understand the appeal of whatsoever; her technical skills are poor, and she often looks rather vacant in the eyes.
I agree with you that when Isabelle Adjani is "on," she is magic. She's uniquely passionate and her face was made for cinema.
As much as I don't particularly dislike Hilary Swank, I do miss the consistent shade being thrown her way via this blog. A hilarious loathing.
My favorite Italian films so far: The Leopard, La Dolce Vita, Nights of Cabiria, 8 1/2, Amarcord, The Tree of Wooden Clogs, Red Desert, Michelangelo Antonioni's alienation trilogy of L'Avventura, La Notte, & L'Eclisse, The Identification of a Woman, Pasolini's Trilogy of Life, Rome, Open City, Stromboli, and the westerns of Sergio Leone.
I never watched Buffy, the Vampire Slayer. It wasn't my thing.
That's tough, probably Isabelle Huppert as I've seen more of the films she's done that I like such as Heaven's Gate, Elle, The Piano Teacher, I Heart Huckabee's, 8 Women, and Amateur in comparison to the few films of Adjani that I've seen and liked such as Posession and The Story of Adele H..
My least favorite Woody Allen film is Anything Else and Jason Biggs' character was the worst aspect of that film as he was a poor man's Woody.
There's some that I just don't understand why they're still cast and be in big movies when they're just mediocre. Kate Hudson and J-Lo are prime examples of women who definitely get major film roles and such yet never deliver when it could've gone to someone else. Hudson for just playing the same type while J-Lo is just a very vain actress as her performance in El Cantante was really one of the worst performances I had ever seen as it spoke vanity in highest order.
Thanks for answering my question! And I actually did a double take since you used the picture of David to open your post and my current phone wallpaper is a photo of that exact David which I took on my vacation!
I admit I asked that question since my answers also tend to run "basic cinephile". I took an Italian Cinema class in college and meant to revisit some before my trip, but didn't get a chance. Bicycle Thieves is an all-timer for me.
IMO a lot of these actors we don't get might prove their mettle when they play against type which almost always mean PLAYING VILLAINS. More people should play fun villains.
I still can't quite get into Margot Robbie. I don't really understand her brand.
I don't get Huppert at all,loathed Elle.
I think Jessica Chastain is wildly overpraised she was awful in Molly's Game
Diane Keaton was good in Reds but i can't take her in lots of things esp comedies
Why is Emma Watson working in films
Yay on Emilia Clarke,fame by TV association
I'm not sold on Kristen Wiig film star
I had soured on Kate Winslet who seemed to give up trying in 2009 until WW showed me she still has the fire
I'll just have to cope with Tiffany Haddish for a few years but I dislike her persona.
I think the Swank hate died down once she got less busy but she is esp fine in The Homesman,she just won a 2nd too soon in a strong field with one of those magic characters who only exist in upbeat movies,though she's solid in it and is a far better Actress than the hate suggests but hard to cast.
Fully on board with your "remain open-minded whilst engaging with art" philosophy. I have always been open to my mind being changed. (Something I say not for boasting reasons, but out of frustration from seeing so many fellow film critics/fans sticking to their guns always.)
I didn't get the appeal and respect for Margot Robbie (and that's coming from an Australian!), until I saw I, TONYA earlier this year. Now I am fully on board, and I am reassessing some of her other performances retrospectively.
However (and I will duck as soon as I say this), I still don't get the admiration for Scarlett Johansson's acting skills. She's fine, but she feels more like the type of actor (like Monroe and Jim Carrey before her) that good directors know how to use effectively, rather than being a great actor in her own right.
Definitely explore the filmography of Visconti! My favorite of the Italian maestros. Sandra, Senso, The Leopard are all masterpieces in my opinion. But I've never seen a film of his that I haven't liked.
It's amazing to think of the auteur resume that Moretz has built for herself... Martin Scorsese, Luca Guadagnino, Neil Jordan, Olivier Assayas. I mean... wow.
Some of the names residing on my "don't get her" list - like Emma Watson - have already been cited in the preceding comments. Anna Kendrick and her nonsense have dragged down several otherwise good movies (like "Cake" and "Up in the Air") . Jessica Chastain usually annoys me - on and off screen. Never bought into Scarlett Johansson as a great beauty - but I must admit she's really grown on me as an actress. I'm always puzzled when Elizabeth Debicki gets showered over and over again with those "Why isn't she a bigger star?" raves. She's okay - but that's about it. Never understood the appeal of Patricia Arquette either.
And like markgordonuk, I'm having touble coping with Tiffany Haddish. But I guess at this point there's no wishing her away.
To the Italian titles already recommended I'd add "Variety Lights","I Vitelloni"(both Fellini) and Rossellini's "Germany Year Zero". Also the wild historical fantasy "La Corona di Ferro((1941).
Emma Stone leaves me cold. I don't get the accolades she is getting. Her performance in The Help just SUCKED...
Markgordon: I agree with everything you wrote but... did you just call Million Dollar Baby upbeat?
Italian films I'd recommend:
Two Women
Senso
Big Deal on Madonna Street
Ossessione
La Notte
Umberto D.-Heartbreaking but very good.
Rome, Open City
Death in Venice
As far as actresses I don't "get" I suppose Kidman and Zellweger, neither of whom I can abide, have been around too long to get in the last 15 years qualifier so I'd say Amy Adams, Shailene Woodley and most of all Amy Schumer who I find singularly repellent.
I'd also land on the Isabelle Adjani side of things though Huppert is a fine artist.
Mike in Canada: Yeah, uh...what movie was he watching? A more coherent critique of the Million Dollar Baby win is that Swank won Best Actress AGAIN for pulling the same basic trick as her first win. She's a pretty good actress, but too limited for more than one win.
I’m fascinated by Sarah Michelle Gellar. She was such an intuitive actress on Buffy, but I do think something calcifies in her performance around the S5 mark. Partly it’s the writing of that character and how Buffy rarely gets to be ‘fun’ anymore, but I look at episodes like Shadow or Into The Woods and something seems off somehow. Episodes like The Body and After Life play into it so beautifully, but something definitely switches in that performance post-S4. I’m not sure people quite knew how to cast her post-Buffy, although I think she’s a scream in Southland Tales. Most of my favourite actors from the Buffyverse come from Angel. Stephanie Romanov and, especially, Amy Acker deserved bigger careers than they got, but I’m so pleased Vincent Kartheiser got a chance to prove himself on Mad Men because Pete Campbell is such a singular creation.
"Satyricon" is an amazing film -I saw the Criterion blu-ray and Fellini was true visionary- nobody working today has that kind of cinematic imagination. Nathaniel I hope some day you do visit Italy and country made for the movies- you deserve your own " Three Coin in the Fountain"
You should watch SMG in Southland Tales, her Krysta Now performance is the best one outside of Buffy.
Dave S -- that's a great point about residual goodwill. That is *definitely* a thing. That's why "important" actors always start from raves... they have to mess up in some way for people to decide they weren't particularly good in something.
joel6 -- i really don't like death in venice and like Two Women just fine but not as much as the films listed. But these other ones i've heard their names. Must look into.
Ken -- you lost me when you called Cake a "good" movie ;)
several people -- emma watson. UGH. yep. that's who i forgot. She is *not* a good actress... but she'll be around forever due to an entire generation loving her from her first role.
My knowledge of Italian cinema is similarly limited to mainly the heavyweights, but I love most of what I've seen of Fellini's (Juliet of the Spirits and 8 1/2 are fantastic) and Visconti's filmography (especially Senso).
Huppert has made more interesting/diverse choices, but Adjani is just a force in everything I've seen. I REFUSE to choose between the two!
Maybe tragic would've been better but she gets to live her dream for awhile,that's the part I meant as upbeat until tragedy strikes.
Nathaniel: your feelings about "8 1/2" and "All That Jazz" are my thoughts exactly. I do not understand how "8 1/2" became so influential... and yet, "All That Jazz" is an all-time masterpiece and I fully agree it wouldn't exist without Fellini's film. I don't agree with your thoughts about "La Strada", though; it's a great movie, although not as good as 'Nights of Cabiria".
Side note about Fellini: why did he stop working with Giulietta Masina? Fellini made two great films with his wife (maybe three, since I haven't seen "Juliet of the Spirits") and then... kaput.
I'm surprised "Seven Beauties" didn't make your list. I thought you watched it recently and really liked it.
I love people saying Emma Stone is not good and using The Help as an argument. Please. Have you seen her stellar, magnificent turn in Battles of the Sexes?
Buffy is my all-time favorite series and I love Gellar, I think she’s great in Cruel Intentions and just perfect in Southland Tales.
And I must completely agree with you on Emma Caulfield, she was always (since s4) my favorite part of the series and she really delivers in Timer. She should at the very least have her own tv show.
Guestguestguest
Fellini not only worked with Giuletta Masina in the magnificent Juliet of the Spirits (1965) but she also starred in his Ginger and Fred in 1985, which is also well worth seeing
Margot Robbie, I have no clue why she gets casted in so many things. Outside my f her looks, she’s a mediocre actress.
I've seen Emma Stone in La La Land and the Oscar win over the brilliant work of Huppert,
Negga & Portman is a travesty. I mean, come on!
Out of topic, but I don't get the appeal of Michael B. Jordan. I like all actresses though😂
ken s: I saw it; enjoyable, although not Fellini's best. Plus, it was 20 years later and just made me wonder more what happened in between that time.
I thought Emma Watson was good in Bling Ring and Perks of Being a Wallflower. She also had good moments in the Harry Potter franchise, but I wonder how much the different directiors influenced those moments.
While I don't hate them, Stone, Lawrence, Robie and Larson are generic, similar bland white girls and they do very little for me. Their range is limited and they already are repeating themselves. I can't imagine any of them being A list popular in five years, unless it's on TV.
I didn’t get Rooney Mara until I saw Carol, after that I was fully onboard!
I don’t get Mia Wasikowska - I think she is terrible in almost everything I’ve seen her in. I also don’t get (as an actress) Greta Gerwig. I barely made it through ‘Damsels in Distress’ and could only stand about 1/3 or ‘Frances Ha’ before turning it off.
And Lily James! Im baffled as to why she is cast in so many huge roles. She seems like either a total blank space or just terrible (wtf was that role in Baby Driver??’).
Check out 'Seduced and Abandoned' and 'A Special Day'.
Nathaniel - what about "Seven Beauties"? You went crazy for it the other day.
I meant other actors besides Woody Allen playing the Woody Allen character hahaha. Thanks for your response. Branagh is also my least favorite. I think my favorite is Jason Biggs, mainly because Anything Else was the first Woody Allen film I saw. I like Woody in Hannah and her sisters but my favorite is definitibly Manhattan.
Now that you say, I'd like to know who's your favorite character of an actor playing a version of himself. Who's your favorite Fred Astaire's Fred Astaire performance? Or Cary Grant's? Or who else?
the boy & guestguestguest -- OH YES. omg SEVEN BEAUTIES. Yeah. Way up there!
I haven't seen nearly enough Italian films.
I've liked:
The Conformist
Il Postino
The Garden of the Finzi-Continis
La Grande Bouffe
The Passenger
8 1/2
I Am Love
Sunflower
A Special Day
I still haven't seen The Leopard, Investigation of a Citizen Beyond Suspicion, Rocco and His Brothers, Ginger and Fred.
I adore Marcello Mastroianni. He has such an ability to create empathy, that I think of him as a beloved family member.
Bruno Bettelheim's famous essay, "Survival", about his reaction to the film Seven Beauties, definitely makes one rethink the movie.
My 3 favorite italian films :
Miracle in Milan
Allegro Non Troppo
Ugly, Bad and Dirty
I really really cant get why names like Salma Hayek, Jennifer Aniston, Scarlett Johansson or Jennifer Lawrence (among others) become to famous when is evident that are so limitated or exagerated, i mean, i feel that they cannot even winkle in natural way.
The word actor is not exactly what i will choose to describe them.
Wonderful ! Thank you Ryan T. I'm in Italy right now ... it is absolutely magical and of course you want to investigate and take this feeling home but walking around more of my favourite movies set in Italy came to my mind (Talented Mr. Ripley, Heaven, Room With A View, Much Ado About Nothing) then actual Italian Films besides the typical classics that I have seen years ago ... !
Maybe not favourites but add to the watch lis and not mentioned yett: My sons room, We have a Pope, Two Woman and Bread & Tulips ...
Thanks also for Amandas answer (and fantastic answer from Nathaniel) - I feel the same but dislike the fact that people judge so easily on the internet - and that is mostly the wonderful thing on this blog - they don't !
We all don't have to drink & like the same wine gladly - I never "got" Cameron Diaz & Drew Barrymore - hard working but not my cup of tea - and unfortunately I have to switch off the movie as I tend to not to believe them ... :-S
And where is Isabelle Adjani today ? I loved her
Yes cal roth ! Didn't understand the Oscar for Lala-Performance (besides that she is very charming) & what else could you do with the that part in "The Help" - but wohoooo what a brilliant turn from E.Stone in "Battle of Sexes" - she was in my top 5 for 2017.
Also don't really understand the dissing for:
Lawerence - why is that ? Is it her unpolished of screen persona adding up or the mix of pop-corn success & art ? There is a definite proof that she is fantastically gifted (Winters Bone, she was the showstopper & best thing in American Hustle) - and I'm 100% she will turn heads in the next 20 years Jono - she's 27 ! ;-)
Hayek - CesarGaytan "Beatriz at Diner', "Frida" - No ? ...not Oscar-worthy but good. She's sex on legs - I give her that ;-) even though I'm gay ...
Aniston - is a fantastic comedian in "Friends" - there's no doubt - rarely seen such a brilliant old-school timing - her movies... well mostly suck.... she turns really great in "She's Funny That Way" though ...
opinions opinons ... lol
I'll probably be kick out of this blog but I don't get Cate Blanchett, every time I see her in a movie I am like: Julianne or Nicole would've been soooo good in that part!
Okay, so we've covered actresses. Anyone have ACTORS they just don't get? I'm getting a bit tired seeing just actresses get dragged through the coals so to speak.
I'll go first... Ansel Elgort.
Emelia Clarke is so good on Game of Thrones, though. She has so many scenes that should be laughably bad, but she miraculously pulls them off. True that she hasn't had much of a chance to do anything onscreen outside of that role, though.
I *get* Tiffany Haddish, I just don't like what little there is to get. I like my pianos to have more than one key.
And Emma Stone in Perks of Being a Wallflower...bliss.
Nathaniel, I'm usually with you 100% on everything (including spinning the globe with my finger on it when I was little)...and now we disagree on three whole things!
Ryan T. - Too many to count. So many generic AF white men that get cast more for their privilege than talent.